This is my first complete pcb.look nice but still struggle to make it work properly....this a current control injector driver circuit,ment for low impedance injector....this is part of the bigger project that is to design an ecu for cng direct injection engine...
posted by dragster at 7:13 PM
0 comments
Only its second year in operation, Sauber PETRONAS Engineering (SPE), a 60:40 collaboration between Red Bull Sauber Holdings and PETRONAS, has yielded extraordinary results with the unveiling of Malaysia's first commercial prototype engine - codenamed E01.
Started in March 1997, the project received total commitment by both PETRONAS engineers and its development partners in the design and analyzing stage of the project.
With a two-pronged objective of applying Formula One cutting-edge engine technology to design and develop a prototype commercial engine for PETRONAS, as well as to achieve an effective transfer of technology and capability to Malaysia by involving PETRONAS engineers in the project, the project was implemented in two phases:
Phase 1:
- Basic Design with Development Partners
- CAE with Development Partners
- CAD/CAE Training for PETRONAS engineers
- 2D/3D Design Transformation by PETRONAS engineers
Phase 2:
- Design by PETRONAS engineers supervised by development partners
- CAE by PETRONAS engineers supervised by development partners
- Advanced CAD/CAE training
Highlight of the first phase was the engine start-up ceremony held on 20 February 1998. Four months later on 23 June 1998, the first Malaysian prototype engine installed in two different cars, was tested at the Pasir Gudang circuit in Johor. The testing marked the completion of Phase A right on schedule, 16 months after the commencement of the project.
Performance:
The PETRONAS E01 can be installed about 15 degrees tilting forward or backward within the engine compartment of the vehicle. This allows the engine to be fitted into any model of cars. Versatile! The picture below shows the Petronas E01 installed in a Proton Waja. Continuous Wide Open Throttle (WOT) testing is conducted on the engine to gauge its durability. At this stage an oil test carried out by development partners using PETRONAS' fuel and lubricants showed that the products are compatible with the prototype engine.
Aesthetics-wise, the engine really looks great. The DOHC cover is in black and green, and look at those polished stainless steel extractors! Yum! The engine is not only pretty to look at. Let’s have a look at its technical specifications.
Technical Specifications
- Specifications: Continuous Control VVT (Variable Valve Timing)
- 2 liter naturally aspirated gasoline engine
- high power
- in-line four cylinder
- high torque
- four valves per cylinder
- low emission
- double overhead camshaft (DOHC)
- low fuel consumption
Aluminum Cylinder Block (without liner)
- light weight
- compact
High Specific Output:- 100 PS/liter
Volumetric Efficiency - 107.8%
First Major Maintenance: 160,000 km
Emission Standards: EURO 4/5
Click above picture to see more clearly.
Original design targets for the engine were 200ps max power, 200Nm torque and 120kg weight. So basically PETRONAS engineers managed to exceed their original design targets.
As a benchmark, the Honda K20A makes 220PS but at a higher 8000rpm. Maximum torque is equivalent to the E01 at 200Nm, but maximum torque is only achievable at 7000rpm while the PETRONAS E01 gets max torque at a relatively low 5300rpm.
The Petronas Satria GTi, spotted at Mutiara Damansara area.
Until now Petronas also had developed other engine for different application, 2 stroke engine for go-kart and super bike engine, maybe more in their planning. Syabash to Petronas and Proton that they are capable to design its own engine, that im sure not many nation can do it, many automotive player just sub their engine design to consultant company or simply buy them . Together Petronas and Proton can create a synergy to become best of the best. Remember….its only in 20 years.
Update: The engine has been bought by Nanjing Automobile from
updated from paultan and internet resources.
posted by dragster at 7:09 PM
0 comments
posted by dragster at 8:06 PM
0 comments
posted by dragster at 8:00 PM
0 comments
VTEC is one of Honda's greatest invention. Though an undisputed expert in turbocharging as evidenced by years of Formula-1 domination while Honda was active in the sport, Honda's engineers feels that turbocharging has disadvantages, primarily bad fuel economy, that made it not totally suitable for street use. At the same time, the advantages of working with smaller engines meant that smaller capacity engines with as high power output as possible (ie very high specific-output engines) are desirable for street engines.
Thus Honda invented VTEC which allows it to extract turbo level specific output from its engines without having to suffer from the disadvantages of turbocharging (though VTEC introduces disadvantages of its own).
The Temple of VTEC is specifically created by Jeff Palmer as a dedication to this great technology and the Temple of VTEC Asia is dedicated to the home of VTEC -and of Honda, Japan and the region of Asia.
In this permanent feature, we will examine the basic mechanism that make up the VTEC technology as well as the various implementations of VTEC.
| The basic mechanism used by the VTEC technology is a simple hydraulically actuated pin. This pin is hydraulically pushed horizontally to link up adjacent rocker arms. A spring mechanism is used to return the pin back to its original position. |  |
The VTEC mechanism is covered in great detail elsewhere so it is redundant to go through the entire mechanism here. Instead we will look at the basic operating principles which can be used in later sectionse to explain the various implementations VTEC by Honda.
To start on the basic principle, examine the simple diagram below. It comprises a camshaft with two cam-lobes side-by-side. These lobes drives two side-by-side valve rocker arms. The two cam/rocker pairs operates independently of each other. One of the two cam-lobes are intentionally drawn to be different. The one on the left has a "wilder" profile, it will open its valve earlier, open it more, and close it later, compared to the one on the right. Under normal operation, each pair of cam-lobe/rocker-arm assembly will work independently of each other. VTEC uses the pin actuation mechanism to link the mild-cam rocker arm to the wild-cam rocker arm. This effectively makes the two rocker arms operate as one. This "composite" rocker arm(s) now clearly follows the wild-cam profile of the left rocker arm. This in essence is the basic working principle of all of Honda's VTEC engines. 
Currently, Honda have implemented VTEC in four different configurations. For the rest of this feature, we will examine these four different implementations of VTEC.
The pinacle of VTEC implementation is the DOHC VTEC engine. The first engine to benefit from VTEC is the legendary B16A, a 1595cc inline-4 16Valve DOHC engine with VTEC producing 160ps and first appearing in 1989 in the JDM Honda Integra XSi and RSi. Examine the diagram of a typical Honda DOHC PGM-Fi non-VTEC engine on the left, in this case the 1590cc ZC DOHC engine. Note that each pair of cam-lobe and their corresponding rocker arms though adjacent, are spaced apart from each other. In the DOHC VTEC implementation, Honda put an extra cam/rocker in between each pair of intake and exhaust lobes/rockers. The three cam/rocker assemblies are now next to each other. The new middle lobe is the "wild" race-tuned cam-lobe. Using VTEC to link up all three rocker arms together, Honda is able to use either the mild or the wild cam-lobes at will.
Note : Though the ZC and B16A are well-suited to illustrate the difference between plain-DOHC and DOHC-VTEC, the B16A engine is not derived from ZC. In fact, ZC and B16A have different bore and stroke. The same applies for the B18A and B18C engines used in the JDM Integra series.
DOHC VTEC implementations can produce extremely high specific outputs. The B16A for standard street use first produced 160ps and now 170ps. In the super-tuned B16B implementation used for the new JDM EK-series Honda Civic Type-R, 185ps was produced from the same 1595cc.
DOHC VTEC can also easily offer competitive power outputs to turbocharged engines for normal street use. For eg, the E-DC2 Integra Si-VTEC produces 180ps from the 1797cc DOHC VTEC B18C engine. This compares favourably to the 1.8l version of the RPS-13 Nissan 180SX which uses a 1.8l DOHC Turbo-Intercooled engine which produced 175ps.
An alternative implementation of VTEC for high (versus very high) specific output is used in Honda's SOHC engines. SOHC VTEC engines have often been mistakenly taken as a 'poor' second-rate derivative of DOHC VTEC but this is not the true case. An SOHC engine head has advantages of a DOHC head mostly in terms of size (it is narrower) and weight. For more sedate requirements, an SOHC engine is preferable to the DOHC engine. SOHC VTEC is a power implementation of VTEC for SOHC engines with the express intention of extracting high specific output. Examine the diagram of a standard SOHC cam assembly on the right. Note that the pair of intake rocker arms are separated but adjacent to each other. In the SOHC VTEC implementation (diagram on the right), Honda put a wild-cam lobe for the intake valves in the space between the two rocker arms. Note that the two exhaust rocker arms are separated by the two intake rocker arms and the "tunnel" for the sparkplug cable connector. This is the reason why Honda implemented VTEC on the intake valves only. 
SOHC VTEC engines are high specific output forms of the standard SOHC engines. The D15B engine used in the Civic/Civic Ferio VTi models (EG-series 1991 to 1995) gives 130ps from a 1493cc capacity. Bear in mind this kind of power levels are normally associated with 1.6l DOHC or even milder-tuned 1.8l DOHC fuel-injected engines !
A novel implementation of VTEC in SOHC engines is the VTEC-E implementation (E for Economy). VTEC-E uses the principle of swirling to promote more efficient air-and-fuel mixing in the engine chambers. VTEC-E works by deactivating one intake valve. Examine the diagram below. In the SOHC VTEC-E implementation, only one intake cam-lobe is implemented on the camshaft. Actually it is really a flat "ring". In operation this means the relevant rocker arm will not be activated causing the engine to effectively work in 12-valve mode. This promotes a swirl action during the intake cycle. VTEC is used to activate the inactive valve, making the engine work in 16-valve mode in more demanding and higher rpm conditions. Honda was able to implement air-fuel mixture ratios of more than 20:1 in VTEC-E during the 12-valve operating mode. The SOHC VTEC-E engined EG-series Civic ETi is able to return fuel consumptions of as good as 20km/litre or better!! 
SOHC VTEC implemented for power is often mistaken as SOHC VTEC-E which is implemented for economy. It is worthwhile to note that the 1.5l SOHC VTEC-E used in the JDM Honda Civic ETi produces 92ps. This is in fact less than that produced by the standard 1.5l SOHC engine's 100ps which uses dual Keihin side-draft carburettors. SOHC VTEC in the D15B produces 130ps. This is 30% more than the standard SOHC implementation !
Examine the SOHC VTEC and SOHC VTEC-E implementations. The clever Honda engineers saw that it is a logical step to merge the two implementations into one. This is in essence the 3-stage VTEC implementation. 3-stage VTEC is implemented on the D15B 1.5l SOHC engine in which the VTEC-E mechanism is combined with the power VTEC mechanism.
Many of us probably has laughed at the poor ignorant layman who said "I want power AND economy from my Honda". We know of course that power and economy are mutually exclusive implementations. Honda decided not to abide by this rule. Now, with 3-stage VTEC, we get BOTH power and economy !.
The diagram below illustrates the 3-stage VTEC implementation. The intake rocker arms have two VTEC pin actuation mechanisms. The VTEC-E actuation assembly is located above the camshaft while the VTEC (power) actuation assembly is the standard wild-cam lobe and rocker assembly.
Below 2500rpm and with gentle accelerator pressure, neither pin gets actuated. The engine operates in 12V mode with very good fuel combustion efficiency. When the right foot gets more urgent and/or above 2500rpm, the upper pin gets actuated. This is the VTEC-E mechanism at work and the engine effectively enters into the '2nd stage'. Now D15B 3-stage works in 16V mode (both intake valves works from the same mild cam-lobe).
Stage 2 operates from around 2500rpm to 6000rpm. When the rpm exceeds 6000rpm, the VTEC mechanism activates the wild cam-lobe pushing the engine into the '3rd stage', the power stage. Now the engine gives us the full benefit of its 130ps potential !
The 3-stage VTEC D15B engine is used on the current EK-series JDM Civic/Civic Ferio VTi/Vi together with Honda's new Multimatic CVT transmission. Stage-1 12V or "lean-burn" operation mode is indicated to the driver by an LED on the dashboard. The 2500rpm cutover from lean-burn to normal 16V operation in fact varies according to load and driver requirements. With gentle driving, lean-burn can operate up to 3000rpm or higher. Stage-3 may not always be activated. The Multimatic transmission has a selector for Economy, Drive, and Sports mode. In Economy mode for eg, the ECU operates with a max rpm of around 4800rpm even at Wide-Open-Throttle positions.
The essence of 3-stage VTEC is power AND economy implemented on a 1.5l SOHC PGM-Fi engine. Many people mistakes 3-stage VTEC as a "superior" evolution of the power oriented DOHC VTEC implementation, describing DOHC VTEC as "the older 2-stage VTEC" and implying an inferior relationship. This is totally wrong because DOHC VTEC is tuned purely for high specific output and sports/racing requirements. 3-stage VTEC is in truth an evolution of SOHC VTEC and VTEC-E, merging the two implementations into one.
DOHC VTEC is the implementation producing the highest-powered engines and used in the highest performing models in the Honda line-up. The smallest DOHC VTEC engine is the legendary B16A. A 1595cc 160-170ps engine that first appeared in the 1989 Honda Integra XSi and RSi, it now powers the famous Civic SiR models. The B16B is a special hand-tuned super high output derivative of the B16A giving 185ps and used in the Civic Type-R.
The B18C is a 180ps 1797cc engine that appears in the high performance Integra line-up. The B18CSpec96 is a special hand-tuned super high output version of the B18C giving 200ps and used in the legendary Integra Type-R.
DOHC VTEC implementations now appear in most of Honda's great line-up. The Accord SiR used to have a detuned 190s H22A 2.2l DOHC VTEC which was also used on the same period Prelude Si-VTEC in which it gave 200ps. The current Accord line now has a 2.0l DOHC VTEC engine that gives 180ps and 200ps in the Accord SiR and SiR-T models respectively while the current Prelude SiR still uses the H22A 2.2l DOHC VTEC engine giving 200ps. A special hand-tuned version of H22A is used in the Prelude Type-S and gives 220ps.
The highest level of DOHC VTEC implementation is of course in the NSX. Implemented V6 DOHC VTEC, originally in 3.0l and now in a larger 3.2l form, it tops the 280ps "legal" limit imposed by the Japanese government for stock street cars.
SOHC VTEC appears in more guises in the Honda line-up. The smallest SOHC VTEC engine is the D15B, used on Civic and Civic Ferio VTi/Vi models in Japan. The D16A 1590cc SOHC VTEC (power) engine giving 130ps is also used on the Civic Coupe and the Civic Ferio EXi (a 4WD model). SOHC VTEC also appears on the Accord models but not the Integra or Prelude line-up. In fact in markets which Honda considers not sufficiently advanced to warrant the DOHC VTEC engines (Malaysia being one of them), Honda markets SOHC VTEC as the top engine for their line-up.
posted by dragster at 1:45 AM
0 comments
Why a Better Engine?
In their book about the Quasiturbine, the inventors have used a set of 14 engine parameters to show than none of the modern engine meets simultaneously all the optimum general demanding criteria. Engines fail to be "all in one" compact, low weight, low noise, zero vibration, high torque at low rpm, efficient on a wide power range... While having homogeneous clean combustion and being multi fuel capable... With our today's Beau de Rocha (Otto) mode piston gas engine, about half the gasoline used in the transportation sector is literally wasted to fight the intake atmospheric vacuum depression generated by the carburetor or injector manifold butterfly-valve (The engine-braking effect). This is half the pollution of the transportation activities!
Engines are at the end of the energy chain, and their pollutions affect the most immediate users environment. Better engines are keys to better environment, not only because of their own improved efficiencies, but also because any bit of improvement has directly amplified impacts on all anterior stages of the energy cascade and industry. This is the reason for Quasiturbine!Last Drops of Fossil Fuel?
If one day we are going to limit the availability of fossil fuel, in which type of engine would you put the precious liquid ? Without a doubt in the most efficient and clean engine. It is important to develop better engines regardless of the abundance or the rarity of the fossil fuel, to attenuate the effect of the inevitable transition and in the perspective of the precious synthetic replacement fuel. The efficient engine development is part of the measures intended to better prepared ourselves to tackle the future... Closer we will get to the end of the fossil era, more the performing engines will be necessary and appreciated!
Environmental Concerns
In his forward statement of December 15, 2003 about the Quasiturbine White Paper, Mr. Myron D. Stokes, www.emotionreports.com wrote :
In the context of the international environmental and resources depletion discussions such as the Kyoto Accord, and taking into account the general population conviction that climate changes are currently endangering our planet, there is a new sense of urgency mandating that no energy technologies can be discarded, and this is particularly true of any sound engine concept breakthroughs. The Quasiturbine technology is among the very few energy and environment tools we have to address our present concerns, and one precious new means available to improve our vital collective objective.
It goes without saying that acknowledging its existence may fall into the realm of a social obligation.
Fossil Fuel and Renewable Energy
The comparison is somewhat unfair. First, fossil fuel comes from pumping an underground reservoir – it is not man-activity stored energy. Second, comparing text book fossil fuel energy contain of about 9000 W-h/Kg with renewable energy systems is further unfair. One Kg of fossil fuel contains “no energy at all, if you do not have oxygen to combust it - on the moon for example”. For mobile applications, the truth is that to combust a typical car gas tank, one need about 2 tones of oxygen, which is taken out of the environment while underway… but should be onboard for matter of fair energy comparison with renewable systems like mechanical coil spring, compressed air, batteries or liquid nitrogen… Amazingly, both the fossil fuel and solar panels systems fail to offer a fair « onboard total energy system » comparison in mobile applications. Just keep that in mind for the evaluation of the future generation of projects…
Quasiturbine Definition
The Quasiturbine (Qurbine) is a no crankshaft rotary engine having a 4 faces articulated rotor with a free and accessible center, rotating without vibration nor dead time, and producing a strong torque at low RPM under a variety of modes and fuels. The Quasiturbine can also be used as air motor, steam engine, Stirling engine, compressor and pump. The Quasiturbine is also an optimization theory for extremely compact and efficient engine concepts.
The Quasiturbine is at the crossroad of the 3 modern engines: Inspired by the turbine,
it perfects the piston, and improves upon the Wankel. The Quasiturbine is universal in relation to energy sources: Liquid and gaseous fuel, hydrogen, steam, pneumatic, hydraulic... The Quasiturbine engine was invented by the Saint-Hilaire family and first patented in 1996. The engine makes use of a complex computer calculated oval shape stator housing, creating regions of increasing and decreasing volumes as the rotor turns. It is capable of burning fuel using detonation, the optimal combustion mode of the future... the piston cannot stand.
How it Works
In the Quasiturbine engine, the four strokes of a typical cycle de Beau de Rochas (Otto) cycle are arranged sequentially around a near oval, unlike the reciprocating motion of a piston engine. In the basic single rotor Quasiturbine engine, an oval housing surrounds a four-sided articulated rotor which turns and moves within the housing. The sides of the rotor seal against the sides of the housing, and the corners of the rotor seal against the inner periphery, dividing it into four chambers.
| |
Intake (aqua), A spark plug is located |
As the rotor turns, its motion and the shape of the housing cause each side of the housing to get closer and farther from the rotor, compressing and expanding the chambers similarly to the "strokes" in a reciprocating engine. However, whereas a four stroke piston engine produces one combustion stroke per cylinder for every two revolutions, the chambers of the Quasiturbine rotor generate height combustion "strokes" per two rotor revolutions; this is eight times more than a four-strokes piston engine.
Because the Quasiturbine has no crankshaft, the internal volume variations do not follow the usual sinusoidal engine movements, which provide very different characteristics from the piston or the Wankel engine. Contrary to the Wankel engine where the crankshaft moves the rotary piston face inward and outward, each Quasiturbine rotor face rocks back and forth in reference to the engine radius, but stays at a constant distance from the engine center at all time, producing only pure tangential rotational forces.
The four strokes piston has such a long dead time, its average torque is about 1/8 of the peak torque, which dictate the robustness of the piston construction. Since the Quasiturbine has not dead time, average torque is only 30% lower than the peak torque, and for this reason, the relative robustness of the Quasiturbine need be only 1/5 of that of the piston, allowing for an additional engine weight saving...
Turbine Comparison
Hydraulic, pneumatic, steam, gas and fuel combustion... produce primary energy in the form of expansion and pressure. Being an hydro-aero-static device, the Quasiturbine directly transforms this pressure energy into mechanical rotation motion with optimum efficiency, whatever low or high is the pressure (QT idle with only a few psi !). Conventional turbines are hydro-aero-dynamic, and they cannot handle directly the energy of pressure which must be converted into kinetic energy. For a given geometry, the efficiency of conventional turbine falls rapidly if the flow velocity moves away from the optimum.
Because the Quasiturbine does not require the pressure energy to be converted into the intermediary form of kinetic energy, it has numerous advantages over the conventional turbines, including on the efficiency at all regimes.
Quasiturbine Solution
Many researches are going on to increase energy efficiency on the long term with piston, hydrogen, fuel cell... Hybrid concepts are ways to harvest part of the "low power efficiency penalty" of the piston engine used in vehicle, but counter-productive measures limit the long term perspective until they could efficiently fuel from the electrical grid. None of these solutions are short term stable and competitive.
The Quasiturbine in Beau de Rocha (Otto) cycle is a relatively simple technology which could be widely used within a few years with substantial efficiency benefits over piston engines in many applications. Large utility plants convert energy more efficiently than small distributed units and should be favored when possible, but on the long term, the Quasiturbine detonation engine is one of the very few means to match utility efficiency the distributed way, while being as chemically clean as possible. Not only the photo-detonation suppresses the energy consuming butterfly vacuum intake valve and so preserving the engine efficiency at low power, but since it requires a much higher compression ratio, it does increases the engine efficiency at full throttle as well.
QT-AC (With carriages) is intended for detonation mode,
where high surface-to-volume ratio
is a factor attenuating the violence of detonation.
The next step in world engine research is to make the gas engine as efficient as the diesel engine, and the diesel engine as clean as the gas engine. The photo-detonation Quasiturbine AC does that and more, by conciliating both gas (homogeneous) and diesel (non-homogeneous) engines in one extremely efficient and clean photo-detonation mode, leading the way to a major efficiency breakthrough! Photo-detonation permits 2 efficiency gain improvements: The removal the butterfly intake vacuum valve (engine compression breaking - which exist at all time within gas engine), and the increase of the compression ratio (well over the knocking and the diesel level). Because the combustion is homogeneous and occurs in excess of air, it is as clean as an external combustion.
Photo-detonation self-fires similarly to Diesel,
but burn homogeneously, faster and cleaner.
Quasiturbine has extra degrees of freedom allowing for thermodynamic and photo-detonation optimization, which other simplified mathematical concepts like piston or Wankel can not pretend. By opposition to dozens of new engine designs, the most important at this time about the Quasiturbine is the fact that it does unknot a new field of development and offers means to achieve what no other engine design has suggested or is able to, and specially for detonation where piston engine has failed for over 40 years...
Not Only an Engine
The Quasiturbines are highly suitable for many « traditional systems » like heat pumps (refrigerators, freezers, air conditioners), pneumatic energy storage, air compressors and water pumps, hydraulic pump and motor, turbo-pumps, as well as in utility co-generation, aviation, marine or locomotive propulsion, Combined Cycle Gas Turbines, Rotary Pressure Expanders for Gas Pipeline Pressure Energy Recovery or as industrial and nuclear boiler steam vapor energy production or recovery...
Not only the Quasiturbine can be used as a pneumatic (air) or steam co-generation engine, but it can run in internal combustion Otto mode and photo-detonation mode, in Stirling thermal, Brayton and other cycles. This makes it suitable for cogeneration and conventional engine exhaust heat recovery (see QT Type Stirling), or for hydro-electric water dams (see QT Type Hydraulic).
As a rotary expander, it can be used to recover MW of pressure energy at gas pipeline pressure reduction stations (or steam pressure reduction stations), and to efficiently replace the expansion valve in more ecological refrigeration and heat pump air conditioning systems (removing the mechanical pressure energy which destroys the cooling efficiency), while offering compression capability. See www.quasiturbine.com/ETypeExpander.htm
Engines in Energy Strategy
The future of energy strategies involve resources, efficiency, distribution and mobility. Because large utility energy station transforms fuel into electricity with a higher efficiency than the small distributed stations or your car engine, there will be a period during which hybrid, fuelcells (also thermal machines), batteries and electricity from the grid (electric power train will still be suitable with onboard efficient generator) will tend to substitute internal combustion Otto engines. However, as more efficient and photo-detonation engines will come on the market, and small engines will become as efficient as large utility stations, this kind of substitution will have no reason whatsoever. Only then, distributed electric generation will become reality, and because of fuel mobility specific energy and power advantages, efficient internal combustion engines will then have no substitute!
Still the resource will have to be addressed, but the most likely efficient solution will be toward SYNTHETIC FUEL (from bio-solar ... or nuclear) similar to conventional fuels, because the best and most convenient way to store hydrogen is to bond it with carbon atoms and make a conventional liquid fuel (will we then enter a carbon depletion era?). For these reasons, no foreseen technology is on the long term going to substitute efficient combustion engines... toward which research and development must continue. Those saying that today improved thermal internal combustion engines come to late in time are missing the point: If thermal engines were more efficient, no one would talk about hybrid and hydrogen...
from.... www.quasiturbine.com
posted by dragster at 8:31 PM
1 comments
posted by dragster at 8:22 PM
1 comments
